Joshua Wong is a Hong Kong democracy activist. He rose to prominence in 2014 when he played a pivotal role in the Umbrella Movement. He has participated in and led a variety of student protests. Wong was Time Magazine’s most influential teen of 2014, nominated for Time’s 2014 Person of the Year, and nominated for a Nobel Peace Prize. in December of 2019, Stanford Politics spoke to Wong about the ongoing protests in Hong Kong and his fight for a democratic China.
This interview was originally recorded for the Stanford Politics Podcast. You can listen to this interview in its entirety here. This transcript has been edited for length and clarity.
Stanford Politics: Could you give us an overview of where the protests in Hong Kong currently stand from your perspective and what you see as your role in this movement?
Joshua Wong: I am the facilitator of this movement, and I hope the wars in Hong Kong are being heard in the international community. [There have been] more than five thousand Hong Kong arrests since a half year ago now; not only protestors, even journalists, pastors, and doctors were targeted by canisters of tear gas and rubber bullets. I hope to let the world know how we suffer in this humanitarian crisis.
SP: There’s a conflict between the Hong Kong protestors’ calls for support from the west and the United States and Bejing’s narrative that all these protests are the result of foreign influence. What do you see as the role that the US should play in this movement and, specifically, what should we as Stanford students do to support the movement?
JW: I hope world leaders can stand with Hong Kong to support Hong Kong’s democratization because Hong Kong’s implementation of one country, two systems is being recognized in the United Nations … The Hong Kong Human Rights and Democracy Act passed in the US Senate; I hope it can be also recognized and signed by the US President as soon as possible.
SP: You were recently barred by Beijing from running in a District Councillor election because of your perceived calls for self-determination. Could you walk us through your stance on Hong Kong’s independence from Beijing? What’s your next move after being barred?
JW: I’m not one to ask for Hong Kong’s independence, but it is a must to guarantee Hong Kong is a place with democracy and autonomy. We will continue our fight in [this]uphill battle and urge more people around the world to support our cause of free elections. The government of Hong Kong should be elected by Hong Kong people.
SP: If there were to be a Beijing-appointed Chief Executive who effectively solved Hong Kong’s problems of widening socioeconomic inequalities, do you think that the protest for universal suffrage would still continue?
JW: Hong Kong people have fought for democracy for three decades, and of course we will continue our fight.
SP: 2047 is a really big year for Hong Kong because it is the year the one country, two systems agreement expires. What do you anticipate happening in 2047?
JW: I hope that in 2047 Hong Kong will not be the place of one country, one system and that we will still be able to elect our own government.
SP: What do you see realistically happening? Do you think that’s a likely outcome?
JW: In our worst scenario, Hong Kong will just be the next Xinjiang, but we hope Hong Kong can be just like the next Taiwain, a place with freedom and democracy.
SP: I think it’s fair to say the Hong Kong protests have captured the attention of the world. In a time where so many other atrocities are happening both in China and the rest of the world, I want to talk about what the makings of a political fight look like. First of all, from where did you draw inspiration for the protest tactics for the Hong Kong movement?
JW: We learned our lesson from the Umbrella Movement, and it’s a must for us to maintain solidarity and unity.
SP: What does that look like in practice? What do you do as a leader to make sure the movement stays cohesive?
JW: We engage across generations; not only youngsters or baby boomers or the elderly trying to fight from different occupations, different family backgrounds, et cetera, we fight with unity.
SP: Have you felt that in practice? Do people from all walks of life in Hong Kong, whether they be right or poor, join your fight, or are there some populations that are overrepresented?
JW: More than 80% of Hong Kong people support our cause to hold the police accountable [and]to urge the government to set up an independent inquiry on police brutality; we only experience and recognize the majority consensus.
SP: Hong Kong is entering one of its worst recessions in history. What effect do you think this will have on the pro-democracy movement? Will Bejing use this recession to tighten its grip on Hing Kong?
JW: The recession is more from the chaos of the US-China trade war instead of the protests. I believe that even business leaders [siding]with protestors and [urging]investigations into police brutality is extremely significant.
SP: Do you think that the trade war that the US and China are currently engaged in will negatively impact the pro-democracy movements in Hong Kong?
JW: It will just trigger western countries, especially US politicians, to put far more attention on Hong Kong.
SP: Just recently, the Supreme Court of Hong Kong ruled that the ban of facemasks in protesting was unconstitutional and then, even more recently, Bejing said that the court has no jurisdiction to rule on the constitutionality of laws in Hong Kong. What is your stance on this? What do you make of Bejing tightening its grip on Hong Kong politically?
JW: China as a country shows no respect for the rule of law and judicial independence.
SP: Do you think this move from Bejing will lead to further encroachment from China onto the rights of Hong Kong? How do you see this playing out going forward in terms of judicial independence?
JW: Judicial independence is not respected from Bejing, and that’s the reason people should support Hong Kong.
SP: The treatment of Hong Kong has been all over the news but the censorship and suppression of Hong Kong isn’t the only situation that has given the world pause. Given your experience with standing up to Bejing, what do you see as the future of political activism in the mainland? What tactics have you learned that are necessary to engage with China?
JW: The situation in Hong Kong is [very]different from the one in mainland China. We hope people around the world can understand that it is a must to support Hong Kong and also China’s democratization. First Hong Kong; next is mainland China. But with the Great Firewall and censorship on the free flow of information, now we put more focus on Hong Kong and hope that Hong Kong can be the starting point.
SP: From that starting point, how do you see Hong Kong engaging with other issues like, for example, the treatment of the Uyghur Muslims or other censorship in the mainland?
JW: As we [say]in Hong Kong, yesterday’s Xinjiang, today’s Hong Kong, tomorrow’s Taiwan. I hope that even today when Hong Kong is under the hotline rule of Bejing, we can still be a place where we can show our anger and continue to fight with our cause of free elections.
SP: You’ve been engaged in this fight for a long time. What have some of the largest challenges been?
JW: Police brutality. How does gang rape happen inside police stations? The riot police fire tear gas; one protestor died, which just makes people [angrier].
SP: Would you comment on the recent escalation at the Hong Kong University of Science and Technology these last few days?
JW: It is unreasonable for the government to allow riot police to dominate the campus and turn it into a war zone.
SP: What does a typical day look like for you?
JW: None of us can guarantee our safety. They just turn the residential areas into a battlefield. That’s the reason that people should stand with Hong Kong and respond to our calls to fight for freedom together.
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Noah Bartelt, a freshman, is a staff writer for Stanford Politics and a co-host of the Stanford Politics Podcast.